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I was listening to a debate on R4 on the way home last night about whether lack of manners is what's dragging us down into a yob culture (it's part of a series called "Is Britain going to the dogs?"!). It was very interesting in the end - much better than I expected - and one particular comment made me think. "Manners are a virtue"
Initially, I was very dubious about this statement - does having good manners make you a better person? Surely it's things like kindness and honesty which make you a better person. Inside things. Manners are more presentational.
Earlier in the discussion they'd talked about a distinction between manners and etiquette. They'd made it clear what etiquette was but not really (to me) what manners were and this idea of manners as a virtue suddenly made me see where the distinction lay. Etiquette is the presentational part - the pleases and thank-yous, the holding of the door which ease our days and make things nicer but are not necessarily virtuous in themselves. Manners on the other hand are tied in with respect. They talked about the shift towards respect which must be earned rather than being automatic. To me, the essence of manners is that you give everyone the opportunity to earn that respect. You never write someone off automatically. You give everyone a fair hearing. I think that is something which makes you a better person.
What do you think?
Initially, I was very dubious about this statement - does having good manners make you a better person? Surely it's things like kindness and honesty which make you a better person. Inside things. Manners are more presentational.
Earlier in the discussion they'd talked about a distinction between manners and etiquette. They'd made it clear what etiquette was but not really (to me) what manners were and this idea of manners as a virtue suddenly made me see where the distinction lay. Etiquette is the presentational part - the pleases and thank-yous, the holding of the door which ease our days and make things nicer but are not necessarily virtuous in themselves. Manners on the other hand are tied in with respect. They talked about the shift towards respect which must be earned rather than being automatic. To me, the essence of manners is that you give everyone the opportunity to earn that respect. You never write someone off automatically. You give everyone a fair hearing. I think that is something which makes you a better person.
What do you think?
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Date: May 9th, 2002 06:09 am (UTC)From:It also seemed to create some bizarre situations which went against my sense of fairness. For example, I recall when I was in my teens that a friend of mine who had arrived at our house earlier than expected, was required to wait outide for me while our family ate dinner, because to let him in and then not ask him to join us for dinner would have been rude, apparently. I never did understand that one. I mean, surely making him wait outside is even more rude? Well that's the way it seemed to me when I was 15.
The distinction between etiquette and manners reminds me a little of the difference between morality and ethics, but I'm not going to get into that minefield!
I like your suggestion that manners are different because they're tied in with respect. That rings true to me. Etiquette is a superficial thing. Manners come more from the real you.
From that perspective, lack of manners is indicative of a decline into 'yob culture', but it's not a cause. The cause is lack of respect for ourselves, and lack of respect for those around us, not forgetting a lack of respect for the land we live on, (which is quite possibly at the root of it all).
The older I get, the more I look for and respect good manners in people. You may shoot me if I ever start talking about beating respect into the young, though. We can only lead by example. Hypocrites need not apply.